Chaos Is Right...
In fairness to Rob Sherwood in the hand where he demanded to see my hand as I was first to act I should simply turn my hand over. And then he would turn over his winning hand.
But, as I didn't turn it over. I announced my hand (which is fairly common), I still maintain it is extremely bad etiquette for him to ask to see my hand. Something I have never faced in 15 years of poker.
On a related point, it is extremely annoying that the dealer turns over all cards at a showdown at Sheffield. They say it's to avoid chip passing. But, if you were intent in chip passing you could just bet one chip on the river and the colluder will just pass.
Instead, this rule stops players playing bad hands or even bluffing because they don't want to be embarressed about everyone at the table seeing their hand.
The sooner they scrap this rule the better.
Oh, a quick note to Lovejoy... you don't really have a tell... I just wanted to make you a bit paranoid. That's the least I could for the pain you caused me with that outdraw!!!
But, as I didn't turn it over. I announced my hand (which is fairly common), I still maintain it is extremely bad etiquette for him to ask to see my hand. Something I have never faced in 15 years of poker.
On a related point, it is extremely annoying that the dealer turns over all cards at a showdown at Sheffield. They say it's to avoid chip passing. But, if you were intent in chip passing you could just bet one chip on the river and the colluder will just pass.
Instead, this rule stops players playing bad hands or even bluffing because they don't want to be embarressed about everyone at the table seeing their hand.
The sooner they scrap this rule the better.
Oh, a quick note to Lovejoy... you don't really have a tell... I just wanted to make you a bit paranoid. That's the least I could for the pain you caused me with that outdraw!!!
7 Comments:
Or more to the point I am right??!!
Keith to be fair this all boils down to the fact that there are no standardised rules. In fact if you remember the festival at Luton in April they had in place the exact same showdown rules as you describe as being in force at Sheffield.
I suppose it's just what you are used to. If I had been in your position I would have turned over my hand automatically.
I still can't agree that I've displayed any bad eitquette over this matter whatsoever.
After your out of the blue comment on my blog I decided to see what others thought of this situation, so I started a thread worth reading on the 'Blonde Poker' forum titled 'Etiquette Question', which maybe you would like to contribute to.
Congratulations on your result at Sheffield.
Rob
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Now there's three words you won't read too often.
Despite the joy of winning, it is a bit of a pet hate mine to try and figure something out, make a tough call, only for somone to throw their cards into the muck. Much worse though, more common on the local scene I suspect, is for your call to be greeted by 'what have you got' or 'flush wins'. The former is commonly exercised by some of the oldbies on the newbies and is very bad form, imo.
I take you point on collusion. I wouldn't have insisted to see your/A.N.Other's cards, especially in a pot that hurts, but I certainly wouldn't say never, especially if a player is of a certain ilk, or gernerally rubbed me up the wrong way.
It's all rather academic, though, since I've played live once this year - a £20 rebuy.
chaos
The reason I said chaos was right was because he said I should have turned my cards over first.
That's what I should have done.
I didn't, I declared one pair and you turned your cards over and I conceeded the pot.
I still maintain it is terrible etiquette for you to ask to see my hand.
Occasionally at some provincial casinos (never the "proper" venues like the Vic or Aviation) dealers turn over all hands at a showdown.
I have never before been asked to show my hand by another player in Europe. It has happened once or twice in Vegas, but they have no qualms when it comes to etiquette anyways.
I think that this is a hangover from cash game rules, where it makes natural sense for there to be a bit of decorum over exposing hands, mostly so as to not embarrass the Stars. The declare down used to be very common in the North for sure. I remember one hand, maybe a chunky £2k in the 90's, where we started off with fullhouse and declared all the way down to trips before I was the "winner" and had to show my hand :)
gl
dd
I was playing in a dealer's choice game in luton a couple of years ago, and was heads up in a hold 'em pot with Dougsie and all the monet went in on the turn. After the river was dealt, he declared 'straight' and I said (through gritted teeth) 'nice hand', and threw my cards face down towards the dealer.
He demanded to see my cards.
A few hands later, i'm not involved an a hand of seven card, and am chatting away with Action Dave. Dougsie loses the pot, and I demand loudly to see his hole cards. He throws them at me one by one.
Well I didn't exactly say that, my reference was really to a bet-call. The check-check is a bit murkier I guess, but the standard is generally the first to act shows, otherwise stand-offs/semi disclosures develop. But I have uttered 'small pair' many times, rather than show after a chk-chk.
chaos
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